Short top-tube, compensate with extra long stem?

I knew that was coming!!!  LOL

that is why I said it is a "short cut" method.  Its not a fitting; it is just a starting point.  As I read it, that was what he was asking for "short cut".  Obviously your body posture, hand positioning, and a lot of other things will impact it.

I could have said - get a $300 bike fit - but that wouldn't have answered his question.   It would answer yours though...

shiggy wrote:
That was such a ridiculous method for sizing. Right up there with using only stand over for frame size.
Never talks about how you grip the bar. No consideration of the bar reach. I can “move” the bar ahead or behind the axle simply by bending my elbows, or arching and stretching my back.

mack_turtle wrote:I move the saddle until I feel balanced and stable over the BB in riding position so I don't rely on loading my arms with body weight. That may or may not line up with KOPS. it's subjective and takes trail and error.

The ”KOPS” measuring method is useful to get the initial setup close if you know where you like the knee/spindle relationship.