The other thread on these tires mentioned a few rims that they were mounted on successfully but any others tried them on Stans Grail, Stans Alpha 400, Pacenti or Velocity rims? I got the G-One 35s mounted on my AC 101 rims and they were fairly easy to get on but the bead was soooo tight after mounting I had to take to shop for help removing one. Tried on a Stans Crest rim and could barely get them on the rim at all even with levers.
My Niner RLT Steel came stock w/Grails & G-One @ 35c though they also came w/tubes. That said, I've not used them as I immediately switched to a set of Easton EA70 XCT w/WTB Nano 40c. But I would assume that if they are OEM spec they should be ok.
I have heard that Stan's uses some different rim dimensions that do cause issues with some tires. My experience w/Schwalbe is that they mount by hand and inflate w/a floor pump. I've used Pro-One @ 23c on Campagnolo Eurus rims and both S-One @ 30c and Pro-One @ 28c on DT Swiss XR1501 rims (20mm). And will likely be installing the G-Ones soon, tubeless.
I vote Dr. Spoke as the tire mounting expert. I have never been able to mount/install any tubeless tires without some form of high pressure forced air, like CO2 or an air compressor. I'm using Shimano C-24, Reynolds ATR and Reynolds Assault. All Tubeless ready or compatible.
Hitchhiker wrote:I vote Dr. Spoke as the tire mounting expert. I have never been able to mount/install any tubeless tires without some form of high pressure forced air, like CO2 or an air compressor. I'm using Shimano C-24, Reynolds ATR and Reynolds Assault. All Tubeless ready or compatible.
Thanks, but I've struggled at times. I think most of the credit goes to Schwalbe. And I've got a compressor as backup and have used it many times.
Dr Spoke is on the right track. Stan's- a product meant to convert non-tubeless tires to tubeless- uses a BSD (Bead Socket Design) which is slightly larger in diameter to accommodate for the comparatively imprecise bead measurements of folding bead, standard tires. This will allow you to convert them to tubeless with less fear of blowing the tire off the rim.
Tubeless design tires have much tighter (comparatively) specifications for bead diameter. And if the tire uses UST dimensions, the bead diameter is even a tiny bit smaller than a standard folding bead tire bead diameter to allow for an air tight seal with UST design/based rim designs. Remember- The differences are within a millimeter or less, but that makes a huge difference in how things actually fit.
WTB, GEAX/Vittoria and Michelin all adhere to UST based dimensions on their tires and it is a well known issue that these brand's tires do not work well- or at all- with Stan's based rims, which American Classic rims are based off of. Sun/Ringle' tubeless rims also use a Stan's based design/dimensions for tubeless rims, by the way.
So, if the Schwalbe G-One is based off a UST dimension for the tire bead, it would be no wonder that it doesn't fit the American Classic rim well, because they base their design off a Stan's dimension. I cannot confirm that Schwalbe is using this UST based dimension for their tire bead design, but it sounds like they are.
This is the trouble with tubeless tires at the moment- There are two major competing rim designs and tire manufacturers that either buy into using UST or fudge it so that they fit more rims than UST based ones. Some rim manufacturers shoot for a middle ground as well. The tire and rim folks are not going to freely share info regarding where their products fall in terms of fit either because that limits sales, which they are loathe to risk doing. Although some publicly do post this information, it isn't industry wide. Meanwhile, the consumer is left to sort it all out on their own dime.
RidingGravel.com has a tire finder guide, and with that we may start adding some info on tubeless tire fit. Perhaps a rim guide is in order as well. It's a monumental task, but we may give it a go.
Thanks GT - that's about the most succinct and best analysis of tubeless rims and tires I've read.
Schwalbe calls their tires "Tubeless Easy." I don't think they're UST but are designed for use w/sealant. As I understand it, a UST rim/tire combo can be used w/o sealant similar to cars. My first attempt at tubeless was w/the previously mentioned Eurus (road) wheels and Hutchinson Fusion @ 23c UST tires. The tires were extremely difficult to install but I usually managed using tire levers. Fortunately I never had a flat out on the road ... until recently. So I cut a sidewall and it took 3 of us, 6 hands, to get the tire back on w/a tube and w/o levers. I thought the issue was primarily the rims which I heard were notoriously difficult on which to install tires. But after my experience w/the Schwalbe tires it seems the problem was more the tire than the rim. So now I'm much more confident of installing a tube out on the road, especially if by myself.
As you may have noticed I'm a big fan of the new line of Schwalbe tires. The road tires are much lighter and faster rolling than their old tubeless line. And the S-One has been a great tire for me on my mixed road/dirt bike. The road grip is phenomenal and it's excellent on dirt in all but the roughest conditions. The first time I put the S-Ones on they held air w/o sealant and I even took them out on the 1st ride that way. If the G-One is anywhere close to being as good as the S-One then they should be a great choice when more volume is needed.
G-One on AmClassic disc 101 rims. Picked up a roofing nail in the rear tire today. Let's just say that the Orange Seal Endurance formula failed craptastically today. The ensuing struggle to get the tire off the rim was finally solved when my riding partner bit it. Yep, he used his teeth to get the tire to break away from the rim.
Typically I can dislodge a tire with thumbs, neither of us could even get a thin tire lever to push in between tire and rim. It's one VERY TIGHT setup.
Remounted really easy after putting a tube in to get going again.
What tire is going to match the G-One for ride but be able to be removed from the 101 rim on the road?
SpeedyChix wrote:G-One on AmClassic disc 101 rims. Picked up a roofing nail in the rear tire today. Let's just say that the Orange Seal Endurance formula failed craptastically today. The ensuing struggle to get the tire off the rim was finally solved when my riding partner bit it. Yep, he used his teeth to get the tire to break away from the rim.
Typically I can dislodge a tire with thumbs, neither of us could even get a thin tire lever to push in between tire and rim. It's one VERY TIGHT setup.
Remounted really easy after putting a tube in to get going again.
What tire is going to match the G-One for ride but be able to be removed from the 101 rim on the road?
\nYou NEED to break the tire bead loose from the rim before you can get a tire lever in there. If you could use the lever first the tire would be loose enough to blow off in use.
We were both unable to dislodge the tire like most other tubeless setups I've run. AKA pushing against the sidewall near the rim to get the bead to pop loose. So were using a tire lever in place of increasingly sore thumbs to try and push it away. Not trying to jam it in there. Concur, no way you'd want that to work with a tubeless prior to getting the bead to break loose. That was this issue...the bead / rim fitment is REALLY good. Too good. Easy to remount but major challenge to remove.
My bike came with AC Argent & Clement MSO 40s, 60 tpi tubed. As an experiment, in anticipation of the inevitable flat, I tried to see what removing the tire would be like. I barely budged the bead. I'm wondering what kind of oaths my dad, a dentist, would have spoken. Had the shop install MSO 36mm tubeless. Hope I haven't sealed my fate [pun intended] far from home in cell-less territory.
SpeedyChix wrote:We were both unable to dislodge the tire like most other tubeless setups I've run. AKA pushing against the sidewall near the rim to get the bead to pop loose. So were using a tire lever in place of increasingly sore thumbs to try and push it away. Not trying to jam it in there. Concur, no way you'd want that to work with a tubeless prior to getting the bead to break loose. That was this issue...the bead / rim fitment is REALLY good. Too good. Easy to remount but major challenge to remove.
\nUse the heel of your palm while bracing the rim against something handy and lean on it.\n\nYour difficultly is likely because of the AC rim's inner bead lock (a good thing) more than the tire. Plus sealant can glue a tire to the rim.
Originally Posted by SpeedyChix Typically I can dislodge a tire with thumbs, neither of us could even get a thin tire lever to push in between tire and rim. It's one VERY TIGHT setup.
I switched my 35 Clement ush's out for these tonight to hopefully pick up a little more speed for the brutally hot summer months here in Fla. 98 today 108 feels like temp. Anyway they were frustratingly difficult to mount but I got them on. Then I had a breach in my rim tape and had to dismount them to put new tape on.
The same thing happened to meI was unable to get the bead to break, I tried everything soapy water, palms heels pliers then finally it popped after I wrapped a cloth around the tire and applied pressure with both hands. Must have done something but what a royal pain. It was almost like a vacuum effect with the tire sucking onto the rim. This was without any sealant in the wheel yet. I'm glad it was at home and not on the road.
Holding air fine, mounted on OEM Weinman Impulse TL rims Inner width 21mm Will ride tomorrow and feel them out. Hopefully my homebrew sealant will plug any leaks out there.
ETA After about 50 miles on these Gones, even with the aforementioned difficulties they are just the tire I have been looking for. They ride a little hard at the low end psi but maybe they will soften up after some miles. I picked up an extra gear and they handle well. Good speed. Might have to step on the bead to break it in the field if it comes to that.
Yesterday, it took me a lot of effort and pain (in my fingers) to get 1 into a Crest, with levers. And didn't seat with a floor pump. Left the rear one for today...
I am using TR Schwalbe tires in all my mountain bikes (Rockets, Ralphs, Nobbys even Marathon in the conmuter one) and this has been the hardest tire I have found.
The G-ones will not work on Stans Crest or Iron Cross. I mounted them on Am Classic 101s and they went on fairly easy but took lots of pressure to seat and then they were next to impossible to pop off the bead. Sold the AC wheelset & built a set of Stans Grails which they work great on. Word is they mount well on the Pacenti SL25's also. The G-One is the best gravel race tire on the market in my opinion.
Hi. I will answer myself: yes. After failing with Crest, I tried a hookless carbon rim (lightbicycle) and everything went easy! It took me 45 minues to get the tire out from the Crest...
Well, bit of inspiration and a lot of perpiration. 3 levers, one of them sharp metalic to allow me to place the lever between the rim and the tire. Risky for the rim and the tire too. Not the thing you want to have to do in the trail.
I have decided finally to buy a new set of wheels. First candidate are DT SPLINE R32. My main concern is if 18 mm inner are enough. It is going to be my first gravel wheels, so any advice is welcome. Thanks
