Quiver of One- Gravel/Road/Touring Bike?!

Apologies if this topic has been beaten to death elsewhere...I did peruse the forum for similar posts and yet still the internal debate is raging! I need a new bike and it needs to be a road bike, a touring bike, and a gravel bike all in one. I don't really care how it performs on the road, I only ride on pavement to train for bigger adventures....the roads suck in Alaska so it's kinda pointless to have a road bike anyway!

What I'm riding now: 
2009 Kona Jake the Snake "gravelcross" bike with some upgrades (700x38c LT2s, road compact gearing 11-34/50-34, and mini V brakes in place of the old cantilevers).

Type of Riding:
Broken/crappy pavement
gravel
mellow trails
weekend to 10 day bikepacking on gravel/crappy pavement

Memorable rides last summer:
Gifford Gravel 50 in Washington (way too rough of gravel for the JTS, I got my ass kicked)
The Denali Highway (150 mile road through Alaskan wilderness- mostly good gravel with a few 20 mile sections of awful washboard and rocky surface)
lots of day rides on bad pavement or good gravel, 30-70 miles per outing

What I want in a new bike
105 or Ultegra
disc brakes
carbon or aluminum
bikepacking capable for up to 10 days totally self supported (I use bike bags, though I do own panniers...)

Bikes I'm considering:
Trek Checkpoint SL6 or ALR5
Kona Libre or Libre DL

Dream trips for this summer:
Top of the World Highway:  https://www.bikehikesafari.com/cycling-the-top-of-the-world-hwy/
Dempster Highway:  https://www.bikehikesafari.com/cycling-the-dempster-hwy-to-inuvik-in-the-canadian-arctic/
Cassiar Highway:  https://www.bikehikesafari.com/cycling-the-cassier-hwy/

Other info
I work at a LBS carrying Trek and Kona, which is why I'm leaning towards those bikes...we only carry mtbs and a few entry level road bikes, so I haven't had a chance to ride either bike. though I did ride a lower build aluminum checkpoint and thought it felt similar to the JTS, but with functional brakes.

From reading lots of reviews online, I realize that neither bike is designed for extended bikepacking. But all those bikepacking bikes are soooo heavy. Steel just reminds me of 1970 and I'm not into retro. I figure if I can do the rides I did last summer on the gravelcross funkenstein JTS with crappy brakes, then either of those carbon bikes won't seem that underbuilt to me. I weigh 145 lbs so with weight limits up to 220 on those bikes I'll run out of legs before I actually overload them.

I'm looking for feedback about those specific bikes, and the uses to which people have put them. And am I crazy to take a plastic bike 700 miles into the canadian (roaded) wilderness?!

Thanks in advance!

I don’t know anything about those bikes so I can’t help there.  But have you looked at the Salsa Cutthroat?  It’s a bikepacking specific bike and it’s not heavy.

Definitely not crazy and either of those bikes will work for you as long as you only need back rack/gear and your kona doesn't have front rack mounts as is so you are probably fine. The thing to look at would be tire clearance with fenders mounted, both of those are probably kind of iffy in that regard. Man that Salsa Cutthroat looks awesome I have to say, made to upgrade my bike packing bike!

Thanks for the feedback!! I agree, the Cutthroat is a nice looking ride, but is definitely more bike than I want (29ers are overkill for what I have planned, plus I want a little more top end gearing...I frequently spin out the highest gear on the on the JTS which is 50-11 so 10-34 isn't going to be high enough). I could totally see the Cutthroat for something a little more offroady and adventurous internationally, or maybe down in the lower 48 where there are tons of traily roads or roady trails...that's why I'm leaning toward the checkpoint (compact gearing) I think the Libre comes with 1x, which I love on my mtb and fatbike but I don't think I'd like as much on a gravel bike. 

in terms of fenders, I haven't been using them, since mud just gets clogged in there and with my current setup there's not a whole lot of clearance with the 38c tires on...I just sport the dirtbutt or get my gear all muddy.

Yeah, I 100% agree on the gearing, a 1x11 drivetrain is just not enough for me, not low enough, not high enough, plus I like shimano more than sram. If I did cuttthroat it would be frame only.

As far as 29, 700c and 29 are the same thing and most of these bikes are set up to handle 650c well. So run 650c wheels with a not too wide tire on a 700c bike and you get a TON of mud clearance with fenders. Something like the cutthroat will eat that up, the checkpoint/kona will do ok I think, but not as great. Buying a complete bike is great but now maybe you have to change wheels on the trek which cuts into savings, so maybe you get a frame and a groupo, some nice wheels and build something up? If you really want a "one bike" quiver it is really, really hard to find something that ticks all the boxes stock and changing parts starts to get expensive.

But I am biased, I just bought my second complete bike literally 30 years after the first. A lot of that was price and race teams giving me stuff but I am picky. The Giant Revolt 0 ticked pretty much every box I wanted in a gravel race bike which is super rare.

Good luck.

Thanks for the great reply tschmidty! Yes on the '29 is basically 700c' comment...I guess when I was concerned I was thinking about the other dimension of the 29er...2.1" width. waaaaay too wide for my plans. but I like the idea of 650b and more clearance. truly I've not always been a Trek fan but their employee purchase program is insanely good, so I'm seriously leaning towards the checkpoint, I just wanted to make sure that I wasn't missing some big glaring drawback to turning the gravel race bike into a gravelpacking bike! 

and while I currently have 3 bikes (full sus trail mtb, fatbike, gravelcross bike), I went years and years with only one. I just recently baaaadly broke both my ankles ice climbing so all of my former pastimes are out of reach and biking is surging forward in my list of passions. Thanks for the info and happy cycling!!

I think the checkpoint would be great for what you want.  I found it to be more agile than most gravel bikes (because of the head tube I guess) and still pretty (probably due to the wheelbase). If I was shopping for your requirements, it would be at the top of my list.  The more backpacking/touring oriented bikes feel a little sluggish to me in comparison.

Your intended use for the bike is what many consider "adventure touring".  Getting away from everything which also happens to include shops anywhere one can repair/replace broken components.  The top two concerns I have with something like the Trek Checkpoint SL-5 are: Hydraulic brakes and gearing which is too high for fully loaded touring.  Yes hydraulic disc brakes are wonderful and have become much more reliable -BUT- IMO it is far easier to damage a hydraulic line or have a cylinder seal fail than it is to damage a cable operated brake (rim or disc).   Gearing really depends on the terrain, the amount of gear, and one's fitness.   The SL-5 would be a very fast and capable road bike with some light(ish) 35mm fast rolling tires.  The entry level Checkpoint AL-3 has mechanical disc brakes but be aware the aluminum frame has less tire (mud) clearance as the max tire size drops from 40mm to 38mm with 4mm of clearance.  IMO the largest tire is best.  Your shop should be able to order from QBP and if so you should check out the Panaracer GravelKing tires.  Beware the GK smooth tires measure a bit larger than the listed size while the GK SK model seems to be true to size.  Moving from a 700c to 650b wheel should allow for a wider tire, but this is not always the case so I would strongly suggest testing this out before making the change.

NoCoGreg wrote:Your intended use for the bike is what many consider "adventure touring".  Getting away from everything which also happens to include shops anywhere one can repair/replace broken components.  The top two concerns I have with something like the Trek Checkpoint SL-5 are: Hydraulic brakes and gearing which is too high for fully loaded touring.  Yes hydraulic disc brakes are wonderful and have become much more reliable -BUT- IMO it is far easier to damage a hydraulic line or have a cylinder seal fail than it is to damage a cable operated brake (rim or disc).   Gearing really depends on the terrain, the amount of gear, and one's fitness.   The SL-5 would be a very fast and capable road bike with some light(ish) 35mm fast rolling tires.  The entry level Checkpoint AL-3 has mechanical disc brakes but be aware the aluminum frame has less tire (mud) clearance as the max tire size drops from 40mm to 38mm with 4mm of clearance.  IMO the largest tire is best.  Your shop should be able to order from QBP and if so you should check out the Panaracer GravelKing tires.  Beware the GK smooth tires measure a bit larger than the listed size while the GK SK model seems to be true to size.  Moving from a 700c to 650b wheel should allow for a wider tire, but this is not always the case so I would strongly suggest testing this out before making the change.

it's true that hydraulic brakes are more complicated than mechanical pull disc brakes, and potentially harder to field repair...I opted for mech pull on my fatbike because I didn't want the hassle when out in the middle of nowhere in the winter, and they are fine...but it's not like I'm ripping down huge hills fully loaded either. the pace tends to be quite a bit slower on a snowy trail than on the road. I have hydraulic brakes  on my mtb, and have never had a failure, even with hard use...but it is something to think about. Anything would be better than the crappy cantilevers which were on there before. they made hills somewhat terrifying. the mini-v's are slightly better, but only slightly. I'm pretty excited for increased stopping power, I have to say.

I'd actually be more concerned about breaking the carbon fiber frame than the brakes though...I might be able to fix a brake issue but I definitely couldn't fix a broken frame and neither could anyone else on the backroad to nowhere...but I tend to be pretty easy on things so I like my chances for non-breakage. 

the gearing is the same as my JTS, which I used on a 5 day solo tour last summer with no problem...buuut I didn't carry all of my food on that trip, as there were lodges to stop at...I did carry enough food for 3 days JIC. I travel pretty light generally (bivy sack, super light down bag, pocket rocket stove with tiny titanium pot, dehydrated meals, minimal electronics) but ten days of food is triple what I brought on that last tour. I'm almost into the need to use the panniers zone, then there's a bunch more weight...maybe what I should do is load up the JTS with 10 days of food and see how doable it is with a larger load. Though my JTS isn't exactly light (~24 lbs unloaded) and the SL6 is around 19 lbs...so I get 5 lbs extra food for the same total weight if I get the SL6!! 

Thanks for the thinking points!!!

I rode a Checkpoint SL6 and an AL5 back to back last summer. They have very similar handling, but you'll definitely notice a difference in comfort between them -- you feel everything through the AL. There's nothing you couldn't do with the carbon Trek -- just change the tires and gearing as needed. IMO the grey and cobra blood colors of the SL5 are more attractive than the boring black of the SL6, and with the money you save by going 105, you could buy a nice set of wheels. Trek needs to get Project One going for the Checkpoint.

Haven't ridden the Kona, but it's 650B only, which for me would disqualify it from the "road" sector. At the least you'd need another set of wheels, but I think it would still feel a bit trucky.

A couple more thots...
Multiple wheel sets are more complicated if one is running disc brakes because the disk has to be aligned very precisely (1 to 2mm of gap on either side).  Yes this can be done but it's a concern.  Conversely swapping tires on a single wheel set is a PITA if one is riding tubeless.  I'm not an advocate of sealant in tubes as I've seen it fail a few times (visualize: latex sealant all over rider and the rear wheel as tubes are swapped.) Yes it is possible to patch a tube that has sealant. It's messy but if done properly it works fine.

The only frame material which can be worked in the wild (so to speak) is steel.  If aluminum is bent, it will be seriously weakened or fail if bent back.  In theory titanium can be bent without damaging the material, but it's really-really hard to bend titanium.  I've fixed bent aluminum derailleur hangers, but a hanger doesn't go through repetitive stress cycles or have much load (force) so a weakened hanger should be fine for many miles until it is replaced.  A bent aluminum frame cannot be straightened without weakening the structural tubes.   Carbon frames can be repaired but not in the wild...  Here's a link describing some of the steps and issues:
https://www.velocipedesalon.com/forum/f10/carbon-repair-process-questions-30195.html

I'm all in favor of mid-grade components.  IMO the 105 is an excellent compromise of price/weight.  My wife's gravel bike has 105 11spd and it works identically to my Ultegra and Dura-Ace.  The Shimano disk brakes are amazing - smooth and light action.  My Raleigh Roker has the Tiagra 10spd and mechanical TRP Spyre brakes.  IMO the Spyres stop just fine, but I'm 6'2" and hand/finger strength/leverage isn't a problem for me.  But if you want light action for long descents, there is no comparison between mechanical and hydraulic disks.  Final concern on disk brakes: disks can warp from heat.  I just purchased a custom gravel tandem and was cautioned by both the builder and other avid tandem riders that the big 200mm disks can overheat on long fast descents.  The simple solution is to carry a light tool for straightening the disk if this happens.  Even if you cannot get the rotor completely true, the bike will be rideable but will may "talk" to you as the rotor gently touches the pads. 

@NoCoGreg...

thanks for the feedback about frame material. I would love to have a ti bike but my SO would freak the eff out (I'm already in the doghouse for the 3 soon to be 4 bikes in the shed). Aluminum sucks to weld, carbon is a pita to repair, and am I really going to find someone to weld my steel frame back together in BFE Alaska or Canada? probably not...so if the worst happens I stick out my thumb and get a ride. If I were going to Cuba or South America, I'd def go with steel and 26" tires, and maybe cantilevers...but that's not my gig. Imma riskit with the carbon I think. 

RE 105 vs Ultegra, the JTS has 105 and it's pretty sweet but I've always wanted Ultegra ! I have miniature hands so in terms of brakes, I need all the help I can get in terms of leverage, though I think the 7070s would probably be just fine. 

Thanks for the thots!

You are potentially going to load the bike with cargo, and you are worried about the couple extra pounds of a steel bike? Hmm. 

If not for that anti-steel thing, I would recommend the All City Spacehorse. Plenty of mounting points, disc brakes, compact gearing, and a geometry that would be great for your purposes. Though the stock components may not be nice enough or offer low enough gearing for you. If you work in a bike shop, they could get you the whole bike from QBP, I'll bet -- or even just the frame which you could build up. Compared to some of the options you are considering, you would have money left over for a second wheelset, or racks and bags, etc.

Just a thought! I also think the Libre looks terrific, though the stock builds don't suit me: the 700c version has a 1x drivetrain, and the 2x version has 650b wheels.  (I want 700c and 2x.) But it might suit you.

NoCoGreg wrote:A couple more thots...
Multiple wheel sets are more complicated if one is running disc brakes because the disk has to be aligned very precisely (1 to 2mm of gap on either side).  Yes this can be done but it's a concern. 

I have heard about this, but are not hydraulics self adjusting?  
Or maybe I'm just lucky I don't have that problem.

Hydraulics do adjust to a degree, but different hubs tend to put the brake rotor in a slightly different place, and that can cause rubbing. Having wheels with the same hub set is one solution--I'd assume they're built to close enough tolerances to place the rotor in the same location. You can just adjust the rotor on one set of wheels with spacers. It would be a hassle, but should only need to happen once. 

I don't think I'll ever get the concerns over dealing with "broken" hydraulic brakes. I beat the crap out of my mountain bike; I've sent it end-over-end down the trail; I've tangled it up in sticks and vines and rocks and logs; and I've never managed to damage the brakes. In fact, the only hydraulic brake failure I've encountered on any ride I've been on was when a buddy lost a bolt out of his lever--and that would have been a problem for any brake. I've got TRP Spyres on my Raleigh Willard. I'm pretty hard on that bike, and use it to race a lot of CX. The brakes are just fine, but not in the same league as hydraulics. 

GSPChilliwack wrote:
I don't think I'll ever get the concerns over dealing with "broken" hydraulic brakes...

I agree that I've never had nor seen a failure of a hydraulic brake due to a crash...

But both my wife and I have had hydraulic brakes fail due to parts in the brakes failing on three different bikes. 
- Air bubbles which got into the brake lines. 
- The cylinder in the brake lever failed (brakes were replaced by SRAM). 
- On yet another bike the C-clip which held various pieces of the brake lever in position fell out (WTF???) on a minor crash.  The clip disappeared but fortunately the inner workings of the lever didn't fall out and we were able to hold the parts together using my wife's hair tie.

IMHO disk brakes are reliable but like everything else in cycling they do have weaknesses. Yeah, hydraulic brakes are much smoother and powerful but IMO a cable is simpler, more reliable and easier to repair in the field.

There is zero question a cable brake is easier to repair "in the field". On the other hand the vastly better braking performance more than makes up for it. I mean we could use v brakes, we don't have to worry about bending a brake rotor or having to adjust pads, which btw  hydraulics do automatically. My first couple sets of disc brakes were cable and I will never go back because even one hydraulic brake works better than mechanical disk brakes.

You should probably just ride a steel fixed gear so any blacksmith in the village can repair your broken frame.

Anyway, conversation has gotten off topic. OP has gotten really some good recommendations for their all in one bike and I am sure they will be very happy with whatever they end up with.

Well said tschmidty! if I fuddy duddy myself too much about the field repairability of schtuff, I won't even need a new bike because aluminum is maybe more easily repairable than carbon and I already have V brakes (they totally suck compared to hydraulics) and then the whole convo would be moot cause I could just keep my 10 year old JTS!!!

I did get some great recommendations, and just the kind of info I was looking for, so thanks everyone!! Now to order the dang thing and start riding...though I have to put away the fat bike and wait for the snow to melt first....! those skinny tires are going to feel so amazing after my 4" studded dillingers!!!

Sounds like you picked something out, but a durable yet road-oriented bike would be the Endpoint Coffee Grinder. When you're ready to tour, swap out the carbon fork for the Hunter/Gatherer low trail fork and run lowriders in the front and a bikepacking seatpack in the rear and you've got something that still handles well with a decent amount of gear.

I just saw one for sale, it was ~19lbs. If you ride a 54, PM me and I can pass on contact info.