Raleigh Tamland 1 questions

Cranksets (w/new bottom brackets) are expensive.  Cassettes are relatively inexpensive.  That is, it's much less expensive to add 4t to the cassette than to decrease a chainring by 4t.

I would consider purchasing a SRAM 11-36 road cassette.  They make 2 - the PG-1170 and PG-1130.  I'm using the 1170 though there probably isn't much difference - higher price, less weight or vice versa.  The cost will be < $100.  In my opinion, the SRAM aren't as nice as an Ultegra cassette but Shimano doesn't make a 36t.  Shimano is very conservative in the maximum cog size they spec for their rear derailleurs.  Myself, and almost all my friends, are using the 11-36 with an Ultegra GS RD, both mechanical and Di2, w/no issues - ever.  For some, we tighten the b-screw a bit.  And some of us have used a Wolftooth Roadlink though it's not been required.  Most have been able to use the stock chain but you may need a slightly longer chain - probably 1 extra link - also inexpensive.  That gives a gear of 34/36 which is < 1.0 and should be adequate for most unloaded riding.

If you need (or think you need) more, for bikecamping and such, my recommendation would be a Shimano mtn bike cassette at 11-40 or 11-42 and maybe even an 11-46 combined w/an XT or XTR RD and a Wolftooth Tanpan.  The mtn bike RD will have a longer cage which will easily wrap the longer chain required.  The 11-sp mtn cassettes will fit on the old 9/10 speed freehubs so there are a lot of wheels out there that these will fit.

By keeping your road crankset you also have more versatility.  That is, you can run two wheelsets - Perhaps your current wheelset with smaller tire and the 11-32 and a 2nd set with a larger tire and an 11-36 or larger cassette.  That way you can match the tire/cassette with the ride/event/conditions for that day.

DrSpoke wrote:

Cranksets (w/new bottom brackets) are expensive.  Cassettes are relatively inexpensive.  That is, it's much less expensive to add 4t to the cassette than to decrease a chainring by 4t.

I would consider purchasing a SRAM 11-36 road cassette.  They make 2 - the PG-1170 and PG-1130.  I'm using the 1170 though there probably isn't much difference - higher price, less weight or vice versa.  The cost will be < $100.  In my opinion, the SRAM aren't as nice as an Ultegra cassette but Shimano doesn't make a 36t.  Shimano is very conservative in the maximum cog size they spec for their rear derailleurs.  Myself, and almost all my friends, are using the 11-36 with an Ultegra GS RD, both mechanical and Di2, w/no issues - ever.  For some, we tighten the b-screw a bit.  And some of us have used a Wolftooth Roadlink though it's not been required.  Most have been able to use the stock chain but you may need a slightly longer chain - probably 1 extra link - also inexpensive.  That gives a gear of 34/36 which is < 1.0 and should be adequate for most unloaded riding.

If you need (or think you need) more, for bikecamping and such, my recommendation would be a Shimano mtn bike cassette at 11-40 or 11-42 and maybe even an 11-46 combined w/an XT or XTR RD and a Wolftooth Tanpan.  The mtn bike RD will have a longer cage which will easily wrap the longer chain required.  The 11-sp mtn cassettes will fit on the old 9/10 speed freehubs so there are a lot of wheels out there that these will fit.

By keeping your road crankset you also have more versatility.  That is, you can run two wheelsets - Perhaps your current wheelset with smaller tire and the 11-32 and a 2nd set with a larger tire and an 11-36 or larger cassette.  That way you can match the tire/cassette with the ride/event/conditions for that day.

DrSpoke wrote:
If you need (or think you need) more, for bikecamping and such, my recommendation would be a Shimano mtn bike cassette at 11-40 or 11-42 and maybe even an 11-46 combined w/an XT or XTR RD and a Wolftooth Tanpan.  

NoCoGreg wrote:
Doctor,
I'm in complete agreement with everything you wrote up to the point of suggesting an 11 speed mountain bike RD (XT or XTR) to use with the Shimano 105 road shifters. 

The good folks at JTEC Engineering may have a SHIFTMATE which will allow this combination?  I've long lost track of all the SHIFTMATE options...
http://www.jtekengineering.com/

Here's a link to a discussion on Shimano Road/Mountain shifter compatibility.  Scroll down the to the bottom of the discussion to a picture which details the road/mountain incompatibility due to different cable pull.

https://www.velocipedesalon.com/forum/f40/11sp-mechanical-road-mtb-compatibility-41943.html

NoCoGreg wrote:I agree with the Doctor, I think the 11-36 cassette is the best first step.  SRAM and Shimano cassettes are interchangeable.  I've seen several others who have used the 36t cassette with the Shimano 105 rear derailleur. The two key adjustments as Doc listed are:
1. Adjusting the b-screw to move the RD farther from the cassette so it clears the larger 36t cog.

2.  Lengthen the chain as required.  To be conservative, simply make sure the RD can accommodate the big-big combination.  You don't "want" to use that, but you also don't want your RD to collapse and bend into your rear wheel if you accidentally use this combination.  Yes I've seen this happen...

Your LBS should be able to handle all this.  One popular "hack" to fit larger cassettes is to install longer B-screw ($1.00) which will allow one to push the derailleur farther from down and away from the cassette. 

As for the 2nd set of wheels, yes absolutely consider this.  My primary gravel bike has two sets of wheels setup and ready to roll.  One set has the 38mm gravel tires and the other set has 32mm fast rolling road tires.   Since your Tamland has disk brakes, just make sure the rotors have been shimmed so the rotors on both sets of wheels are in the exact same position.  Yes hubs from different manufacturers can vary. The rotor/pad location is precise and you probably don't want to have to readjust the pads every time you change wheels - nor listen to a rotor which is rubbing the pads.

RoverAl wrote:Hey Zman, looks like your making progress that 11-36 should do the trick.
A couple threads back you mentioned a 3lb tent. I'm shopping around for a tent. I kind of narrowed it down to the Kelty TN2 and was curious about the one you mentioned.
Thanks 
Al

Cmtgravel wrote:Zurichman, You're a 200+ lb rider like me. Going tubeless is NOT gonna make hills easier. Losing 10-20 lbs will. I'm struggling with this also, I wish you luck. I would imagine what made it so difficult was A: the Raleigh is prob heavier,maybe by a few lbs; B: more rolling resistance from knobbier,fatter,heavier tires; and C: the triple on your road bike has lower gearing than the double on your Raleigh. I originally joined this forum looking for lower gear options. I've settled on an FSA afterburner mtb crankset with 42/27 chain rings. Many people have criticized saying my gears will be too low, or I'm losing too much on the high end, I want low gears!!! I want to be able to pedal up everything!. Also, if you consult a gear calculator, my high gear of 42x11 is close to a 50x13. I've never spun out 50 x 13 on a gravel downhill. My low gear of 27 x 36 gives me 20 gear inches, significantly lower than previous 25 gear inch 34x 36 low gear option. Also, consulting gear inch calculator, you will find that the standard 50/34 crankset with 11-32 or 11-36 in rear results in 10 identical redundant gears. Smaller chain rings give more options, and 20 out of 22 gears . I went with mtb crankset cuz I could get online for 95 bucks. The road options out there are all 400+ dollars. P.S. Your 105 rear derailleur WILL take up to 36t with slight adjustment by LBS. I've been riding 11-36 in rear with no probs for 2 years.

Zurichman wrote:
So curious as to what adjustments you would have to do for it to take the 11-36. My LBS wants to sell me some kind of derailer extender and a new chain.
Zman

Zurichman wrote:

So curious as to what adjustments you would have to do for it to take the 11-36. My LBS wants to sell me some kind of derailer extender and a new chain. 

Zman

Zurichman wrote:

So question for you DrSpoke since I don't understand this much. Are you saying that you just put on the SRAM 11-36 on your stock wheel and then still keep the Shimano shifters and it will work. I probably won't do anything until after the Farmers Daughter ride in about 13 days. On another note I did a grueling 65 mile ride yesterday on the road bike called the Tour de Cure. I had a free ride into the ride because last year I was the only one that finished the metric ride in monsoon like conditions. Everybody else bailed after the 1st 32 mile loop. I was riding in full winter gear as it was cold here in Pa. yesterday. I was riding with some slower riders so I would ride my pace on climbs or during the ride and then would soft pedal for them to catch up. This guy passes me and gives me the look. I decided to go after him on the one climb and he was 50-75 yards ahead of me. I looked down at my speedometer once it was reading 25 mph. Amazing what a difference of a few lbs. and skinny tires does. I must still have it.

Zman

NoCoGreg wrote:
Doctor,
I'm in complete agreement with everything you wrote up to the point of suggesting an 11 speed mountain bike RD (XT or XTR) to use with the Shimano 105 road shifters. 

The good folks at JTEC Engineering may have a SHIFTMATE which will allow this combination?  I've long lost track of all the SHIFTMATE options...
http://www.jtekengineering.com/

Here's a link to a discussion on Shimano Road/Mountain shifter compatibility.  Scroll down the to the bottom of the discussion to a picture which details the road/mountain incompatibility due to different cable pull.

https://www.velocipedesalon.com/forum/f40/11sp-mechanical-road-mtb-compatibility-41943.html

Zurichman wrote:

Thanks for all the feedback guys I did pull the plug today and buy a 11x36 PG-1130 from my LBS. I paid $20+ more than I could have bought if for from Art's Cyclery($51) in CA. versus $75 and then he is going to put on some kind of extender on the bottom bracket another $20 and a new chain $30. My bike should be ready to roll then and I will feel more confident in climbing some hills/climbs. Art's cyclery was going to take a week and then a week to get the part to me and so time is kind of the essence here as I want to be able to have this worked out before  my 1st ride. My LBS is going to have everything there by Weds(2 days) and have the bike done. Of course us Americans don't have the I want it now syndrome at all.

Thanks again
Zman

DrSpoke wrote: So he installed a Shimano XTR RD and a Tanpan and it works great w/the Shimano road shifters (mechanical, of course/hydro).  The other advantage is these have a clutch system so you get less chain slap and presumably fewer dropped chains.  In fact I plan to use this on a future build and it would be my go to setup for a road drop bikecamping bike.

NoCoGreg wrote:
I think your LBS is taking the conservative path of going with something they have done in the past.  My suggestion is to have them:
1. Install the new cassette and see if they can make it work without adding links to the chain OR the derailleur extender.

2. If links are required, and this is not uncommon when going to a cassette with a larger 1st gear, then have them add links to the chain or install a new chain.

As CMT and Doc have said, the 105 rear derailleur should work fine with the 36t large cog of the cassette - the extender should not be needed.

The key adjustment on the rear derailleur for the new cassette is the B-Screw. As I previously mentioned, if required the shop can install a longer B-Screw to push the rear derailleur farther and make room for the 36t cassette.  But others have been able to use the 36t cog without needing a longer B-Screw.

Should you go the route of replacing the crankset as CMT did, you will not need to replace the chain - instead of longer the chain would need to be shortened. 

Or for the ultimate in wide and low gearing, you could replace the cassette and crankset to get really-really low gears.

Zurichman wrote: With the bike only having 30 miles on it is there a chance that it wasn't lined up right from the factory. I am not sure if my LBS has that tool but if he does I am sure he would use it if I asked him. Here is the kicker though I was going to drop the bike off at lunch time so I could pick it up after work. If this hanger adjustment is that critical I probably won't take it in till after work so I make sure it is done. Not that I don't trust my LBS but if I am paying good money to go over and beyond to have it fixed right I want it right. If that makes sense.n