I believe it has to do with the way the contact patch changes as the bike leans. It's still there with flat bars and fat tires. A touch more air pressure will usually make it away, but then what's the point of the big tire?
Maybe it just means there is another reason to have a bit of tread on the bigger tires.
I'd be using these tires on a drop bar 29er of some sort, for rides in early spring where the roads are potholes like the moon, plus mud and snow. Also for offroad grass trails and such where my Warbird is just a bit too much under biked. Thus, tread starts to look very useful.
Vittoria just came out with 50mm Terreno Drys. While not the fastest tires around, they probably have the best combination of grip, speed and durability. 54mm should be available soon. The big tires are coming and I am happy about it.
Having a lot of experience with RaceKing and RH knobby tires on a Fargo I can't say the RaceKing was bad in anyway but the RH knobby was far superior. Far superior explained this way. Riding with others on road and gravel bikes on same loops and alone, the RH would not feel like at terminal velocity or harder pedaling at faster speeds. A loop I did a lot would have my cycling app seem to show the RH knobby faster than racer the racer type MTB tire. The RaceKing would pack when the RH knobs threw mud.
The RaceKings were "2.1" if I recall and I've got the RH knobby in their 48 and 55 mm.
In a big group event and some group rides that were a wide range of conditions the some of us with the RH knobby tires had a big advantage when the going was at the extremes of smooth or needed a knobby tire.
I've had large diameter slicks and almost slicks and won't do that again - too easy to be spooky or needing more traction. A friend who had the Schwalbe big round tires and the 55 MM RH knobby felt the same.
My gripes for the RH tires are price and the tan sidewalls but getting another set and not another set of RaceKings should say enough.
Donneley MSO is another great 50 mm I'd get any day over RaceKings on a gravel or bike packing rig.
Vittoria just came out with 50mm Terreno Drys. While not the fastest tires around, they probably have the best combination of grip, speed and durability. 54mm should be available soon. The big tires are coming and I am happy about it.
They already have the 54mm it's the Terreno 29x2.1.
There was a time I would agree with you in regards to “ XC - R&D market will beat out gravel “ But in my humble opinion not so much any more - 50/50 now
Fwiw - I like 50c Panaracer GK SK enough to repurchase again and I have tried more 47c - 2.1 than I care to admit. Last having been around awhile though not scientific I certainly trust Guitar Ted’s trial ride testing and what he writes in regards to that. Make it a great day!
I enjoyed the Thunder Burts thoroughly in the protective casing. I enjoyed them more SK 43mm and SK(+f non-+r) 50mm. It was also lighter than the (non-+)50mm, which is bonkers to me.
I only recently realized that BRR doesn't test gravel tires >45mm. And doesn't test MTB tires <55mm. So the range of gravel tires in the 47-50mm window are totally ignored.
As someone with a love for the drop bar 29er/adventure/ monstercross bikes, this leaves a huge blind spot. And subjective "this rolled fast" impressions are often unreliable.
But this has me wondering, if the bike is built for 29er tires, is there any point to the gravel oriented options here? Or just get a Conti Race King and call it a day? My suspicion is that the R&D behind the XC market will beat out whatever work is being done on something that is a nice product in the gravel world but wondering what other people have found.
I noticed that matter of what's tested but also don't use the BRR and other tests to completely influence my decisions.
FWIW, I just had to re-tape the Fargo that has had the Race King, Donnelley, and Rene Hearse tires and put the 48 mm Rene Hearse Oracle Ridge back instead of the 55 mm Fleecer Ridge. Just no way would I get the plenty fine Race Kings over the RH knobby tires again. The RH knobby don't pack mud yet roll so well. If one is in the can't/won't RH tires camp, the MSO Donnelley are quieter. That tread is in the really durable but nice feeling standard and the Tufo made premium version.
Another observation was as Race Kings wore you'd hear and be on side lugs more opposed to the pretty much same size 55 mm RH knobby tires acting and sounding consistent as they wore.
The only advantage I could give to Race Kings would be some extreme lean where in most cases no way could I count on them the way a non-race type MTB tire would hold.
On different style bikes I've had slicks and DJ tires in that around 50-55 mm width but would no way want them on the sand and loose that can be on pavement or hard trails. They would too easily slide from under you or roll on tiny pebbles.
I noticed that matter of what's tested but also don't use the BRR and other tests to completely influence my decisions.
FWIW, I just had to re-tape the Fargo that has had the Race King, Donnelley, and Rene Hearse tires and put the 48 mm Rene Hearse Oracle Ridge back instead of the 55 mm Fleecer Ridge. Just no way would I get the plenty fine Race Kings over the RH knobby tires again. The RH knobby don't pack mud yet roll so well. If one is in the can't/won't RH tires camp, the MSO Donnelley are quieter. That tread is in the really durable but nice feeling standard and the Tufo made premium version.
Another observation was as Race Kings wore you'd hear and be on side lugs more opposed to the pretty much same size 55 mm RH knobby tires acting and sounding consistent as they wore.
The only advantage I could give to Race Kings would be some extreme lean where in most cases no way could I count on them the way a non-race type MTB tire would hold.
On different style bikes I've had slicks and DJ tires in that around 50-55 mm width but would no way want them on the sand and loose that can be on pavement or hard trails. They would too easily slide from under you or roll on tiny pebbles.
The Race Kings are half price vs RH and widely available so still not a bad choice. For 40-44cm drop bar bikes I like them and the Thunder Burts in 27.5" al lot.
The Race Kings are half price vs RH and widely available so still not a bad choice. For 40-44cm drop bar bikes I like them and the Thunder Burts in 27.5" al lot.
This is true, but the RH come to mind the way so many posts here search for what's best. While we have RH knobby on a bike, the good in the Panaracer SS+ on a bike is the overall combo of price and what they do.
An associate with the RH knobby said they are seriously expensive commuters but called them "weapons grade" for a self-supported with overnight 160 mi mostly unpaved and at times rotten ATV trail ride we did.
RideWithPride wrote:
Which version MSO,the regular or the Euro made WC version?
Both are really good for different reasons. The regular are heavy but still supple, durable, and easy tubeless setup. I was seriously impressed with them for shoulder season commuting and rides with single track and sharp rock that do in a lot of tires. CX competitors and weight weenie sorts I know love the Tufo made tires.
Indeed, I rode the RH 650b 48mm knobbies in endurance plus casing a summer through the Dolomites and never suffered any flats, they are pretty much bomb proof and still roll well on tarmac. I did find them a bit slippery on the front on wet forest tracks, does anybody have the same experience?
I ride the Tufo Thunderos 40mm on my 700c wheels and never looked back, best set & forget tire that is also fast enough on road rides when ridden at a bit above 2 bar.
Indeed, I rode the RH 650b 48mm knobbies in endurance plus casing a summer through the Dolomites and never suffered any flats, they are pretty much bomb proof and still roll well on tarmac. I did find them a bit slippery on the front on wet forest tracks, does anybody have the same experience?
I ride the Tufo Thunderos 40mm on my 700c wheels and never looked back, best set & forget tire that is also fast enough on road rides when ridden at a bit above 2 bar.
Yes on front tires. You bring up where a true MTB type - softer rubber, side lugs - have an advantage but I ride a MTB with appropriate tires or know the overall advantages of the RH tires I have.
You also bring up why Tufo Thundero or Speedero are on my radar to replace my GravelKings.
Rode my pals bike with the 48mm RH knobbies in standard(650) and endurance(700) and it was cool and all, but they were not a good as the Thunder Burts when it came to gravel. Those things are near perfect in my book.
Deepens on where ya ride and what you ride really. I have a Tumbleweed Stargazer Drop Bar & Knobby bike with Teravail Ehlins on it and I have an Evil Chamois Hagar with Soma Cazaderros in the 50mm width on it. I see advantages to both.
Naturally the 29er equipped bike is best off road and rough roads. Around town it’s smooth as silk because of the big tires but fast it is not.
My Evil is fast on gravel and great on pavement too. It’s’ even a lot of fun on singletrack and you can do a lot with a 50mm on singletrack depending how rough it is. But all the singletrack I ride it works fine…just have to watch it a tad more in some sections but that makes it more fun.
I’ve debated tweaking the Evil geo for a custom frame that fits 2.1 tires. I really really like my evil and one of my top 3 favorite bikes of the last 30+ years of riding. But there are times a little bigger tire would be nice, and other times being able to run fenders yet keep the 50s on would be nice.
BRR did test the Michelin Power Adventure and found excellent wet grip and puncture resistance, reasonably light wight, and average rolling resistance. It has almost no knobs and there was no mention of suppleness.
I ordered a pair in 42-622 from BikeINN but won't be able to test them for a while since I had a knee replacement just 2 weeks ago.
Indeed, I rode the RH 650b 48mm knobbies in endurance plus casing a summer through the Dolomites and never suffered any flats, they are pretty much bomb proof and still roll well on tarmac. I did find them a bit slippery on the front on wet forest tracks, does anybody have the same experience?
I ride the Tufo Thunderos 40mm on my 700c wheels and never looked back, best set & forget tire that is also fast enough on road rides when ridden at a bit above 2 bar.
