Conti Race King Protection as a 60/40 Road/Off-Road “Monster” tire?

42 replies · 6,852 views

Familyridz
70 posts
#21Jun 3, 2021, 2:02 PM
What sealer did you use? I’m looking at finally going tubeless, and have GP 5000s on the road bike and other brands on the gravel bike. Conti Revo Sealant is reported in some places as the only thing that works with Conti tires, but that might be older tires. The Revo is interesting vs Stan’s because it is supposed to last longer without drying out, not use ammonia (the lungs say 👍), not make Stanimals or plug valves. It has the downside of not being CO2 compatible, but could still use CO2 for a tube in a blowout, and the rest of the time pumping up a slight loss after a puncture that sealed is no biggie.

For some reason—NC humidity or mixing sealants perhaps—my LBS says they have good luck with Stan’s but people bringing in Orange seal issues frequently which I know isn’t the case out west.

If Stans does work on Conti tires, I’ve read Race is best, but can’t be topped off via valve. Can you start with Race and then add regular Stan’s to keep it liquid?

Thanks.
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DarKris
83 posts
#22Jun 3, 2021, 2:08 PM
I live in WNY and use Orange Seal Endurance sealant. Pretty much all I use consistently w/o issue.
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ccand51997
265 posts
#23Jun 4, 2021, 3:00 PM
DarKris wrote:They measured both sub 600g (590g range) and they aired up tubeless pretty well. They didn’t seem to lose a lot of air like with the Resolutes, also only about 100gs heavier than those but much more volume.

These do “feel” surprisingly fast. I really want to do a test ride so that I can fully compare them to the Resolutes, but I’m trying to take it easy on my knee as I’ve been overdoing the riding despite injuring myself....

You can hardly go wrong with the new Raceking Protection tires. No one yet makes a big volume tire with a little tread that comes close in speed. Others have mentioned the Rene Herse tires with knobbies, but BRR tested a smaller Steilacom version that is similar to the Fleecer Ridge and it was not fast. I can't speak to its other qualities.
I just think that Conti knows stuff about rubber that others do not. The problem is, in my opinion and as someone else mentioned, there is a gap between the 40mm Terra Speed and the 55mm RaceKing. I need a lot of float in sand where I am at, so off-road the Raceking is perfect. When the tire is new, I can hear the knobs squirm on steep, paved climbs. I usually take a sander and knock off some of the center rubber. I never have traction issues and a smooth centerline makes the Raceking a great overall tire. Make no mistake, its not as fast as your road tires, but no one makes a high-volume, mostly slick fast tire close to 50mm anymore (I'm talking to you Schwalbe and your ruination of the G-One Speed with that Addix Speedgrip trash).
If your gravel is not crazy, I would definitely try the Speedking Racesport. That is going to be my next purchase for gravel raceday (I use a liteskin/onestar Thunder Burt up front with the Raceking on back right now.)
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DarKris
83 posts
#24Jun 5, 2021, 11:07 AM
ccand51997 wrote:
If your gravel is not crazy, I would definitely try the Speedking Racesport. That is going to be my next purchase for gravel raceday (I use a liteskin/onestar Thunder Burt up front with the Raceking on back right now.)

I'm actually considering that since I now have a second wheelset with more trail oriented tires (oops lol). How do those set up tubeless? I've seen people saying that the sidewalls leak on the non-protection tires so I was a bit hesitant. But knowing that I have a more road oriented wheel I think the Speed King may just be my fastest/most efficient/most comfortable tire option
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Familyridz
70 posts
#25Jun 5, 2021, 1:19 PM
Something to check out on the Rolling Resistance comparisons is that perhaps due to what size tires were initially released in, the tires tested arent the closest in size. I was looking at these three and note the sizes available, where picking 40 for the first two would match and then an average of 38 and 42 for the third would be a fair comparison:

Scroll down and the measured widths have a bigger difference:

Obviously, if these were the same size, the weight and RR differences would diminish. Also the casing thickness is higher on the second two, and they wrote about the Spec pathfinder:

“ t's made from a tubeless-ready 120 TPI casing with reinforced sidewalls and a BlackBelt anti-puncture strip under the center of the tread. Almost all gravel bike tires come with reinforced sidewalls, but we do not see an anti-puncture strip under the tread all that often”

Then on sealant they note that as you add sealant and lower PSI, you gain about 0.5W.:

It seems that that thicker casings seal better/faster, and perhaps the belt in the Pathfinder makes running Stan’s regular instead of race or other sealant without thickener additive safer at a lower sealant volume/weight.

Seems like there are a lot of good options and it’s just dialing in what’s best for your terrain, load, wheel size etc.

Are there any rules of thumb for bigger riders/ bikepackers loading to 300 lbs which is probably 180+ on rear wheel, what pressures to run to avoid rim damage on larger gravel?
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Doub
2 posts
#26Jun 9, 2021, 9:02 PM
I have an older set of RaceKings on my Fargo. Good tires, but not that fast on pavement (and quick to wear out). I would throw Donnelly MSO 700X50s in your consideration set. 2.0 tire that rolls way faster and will last longer on mixed surfaces. Save the Conti for the singletrack. (This is coming from a 265lb rider btw). I do love me some MSOs…..
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DarKris
83 posts
#27Jun 9, 2021, 9:06 PM
Doub wrote:I have an older set of RaceKings on my Fargo. Good tires, but not that fast on pavement (and quick to wear out). I would throw Donnelly MSO 700X50s in your consideration set. 2.0 tire that rolls way faster and will last longer on mixed surfaces. Save the Conti for the singletrack. (This is coming from a 265lb rider btw). I do love me some MSOs…..

I rode those back when they were the Clement tires and honestly was kind of let down with how heavy they were.

I didn't stop shopping around for tires and got a pair of Gravelking SK 50mm. Had these before but I want to give them another shot. Oh how I would have loved 50mm Gravelking SS tires...
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DarKris
83 posts
#28Jun 20, 2021, 9:00 PM
So update: I have the Gravelking SKs mounted to my new i29 wheels and let me just say - these roll sooooo well! Maybe the combination of changing wheels and tires led to this. What I will say is that the 50mm Gravelkings feel like a good balance between volume off-road and rolling efficiency on road.

I will have the tires mounted to some 25mm DT Swiss wheels that I’m having built up. But for now I’m actually really happy and content with how the wheels and tires perform
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chas
1,305 posts
#29Jun 21, 2021, 1:39 PM
Familyridz wrote:

Are there any rules of thumb for bigger riders/ bikepackers loading to 300 lbs which is probably 180+ on rear wheel, what pressures to run to avoid rim damage on larger gravel?

Well, that original bicycle quarterly tire drop chart is a starting place - someone extrapolated that for tandems, and that would work (or just expand the lines out to the right a bit yourself).

My experience with that weight is mostly tandem (350-500lbs) Almost any tire pressure will work, as long as you don't bottom out. That said, its easy to bottom out (and pinch flat) if you roll over an object bigger than your tire. Obviously you don't want to go too low to reduce steering stability (although that has a lot to do with rim width).

DarKris wrote:So update: I have the Gravelking SKs mounted to my new i29 wheels and let me just say - these roll sooooo well! Maybe the combination of changing wheels and tires led to this. What I will say is that the 50mm Gravelkings feel like a good balance between volume off-road and rolling efficiency on road.

Just another touch point - but IMHO the 48mm GK-SK (650b) was pretty slow and loud on the road. I didn't get that impression from the 35mm version, but the big ones are different.
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DarKris
83 posts
#30Jun 24, 2021, 9:37 AM
Well from my experience with the 700x50mm Gravelking SK it has been pretty good. I’m guessing the difference with the 650b x 48mm comes with the lack of rollover.
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imwjl
304 posts
#31Jun 26, 2021, 9:35 AM
Doub wrote:I have an older set of RaceKings on my Fargo. Good tires, but not that fast on pavement (and quick to wear out). I would throw Donnelly MSO 700X50s in your consideration set. 2.0 tire that rolls way faster and will last longer on mixed surfaces. Save the Conti for the singletrack. (This is coming from a 265lb rider btw). I do love me some MSOs…..

What I thought until I had the Hearse knobby tires in 48 and 55 size - both endurance casing.
I don't care what the rolling resistance site says about Race Kings having done a lot of miles with them, MSOs and now the Hearse knobbies. Do you ride on a treadmill? Do you never turn? Do you ever encounter that sort of gravel f*ckry when ATVs or autos mess it up? Mud?
As much as I loved 50 mm MSOs, the Hearse endurance casing are lighter and don't pack up. No flats yet commuting and riding rocky single track.
The Hearse knobby tires are sort of plug your nose and look the other way for being in the tan wall trend but just really good. If a compromise or jack of all trades was ever a good thing, they're it.
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FrankTuna
7 posts
#32Mar 23, 2022, 9:57 AMedited
imwjl wrote:

What I thought until I had the Hearse knobby tires in 48 and 55 size - both endurance casing.

I don't care what the rolling resistance site says about Race Kings having done a lot of miles with them, MSOs and now the Hearse knobbies. Do you ride on a treadmill? Do you never turn? Do you ever encounter that sort of gravel f*ckry when ATVs or autos mess it up? Mud?
As much as I loved 50 mm MSOs, the Hearse endurance casing are lighter and don't pack up. No flats yet commuting and riding rocky single track.
The Hearse knobby tires are sort of plug your nose and look the other way for being in the tan wall trend but just really good. If a compromise or jack of all trades was ever a good thing, they're it.

Sorry for bumping an older thread but are you still enjoying the RH knobbies? I just built up a Salsa Cutthroat and used Race Kings based on BRR data (and before seeing this thread!).

I'm thinking about getting the 29x2.2 Fleecer Ridge. Many gravel routes/rides near me can be 50% pavement so I need something that rolls well on and off road. After a few rides, the Race Kings really seem to drag on pavement but to be fair I think the pressure was too low.

Thanks!!
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imwjl
304 posts
#33Mar 23, 2022, 11:17 AM
FrankTuna wrote:

Sorry for bumping an older thread but are you still enjoying the RH knobbies? I just built up a Salsa Cutthroat and used Race Kings based on BRR data (and before seeing this thread!).

I'm thinking about getting the 29x2.2 Fleecer Ridge. Many gravel routes/rides near me can be 50% pavement so I need something that rolls well on and off road. After a few rides, the Race Kings really seem to drag on pavement but to be fair I think the pressure was too low.

Thanks!!
We (wife, me) have the 55 and 48 mm versions of the RH knobbier. The 55s are on our Fargo. I took the 48s off right now because that bike's being sold, and I have Bongtrager GR1s on the fancy plastic wheels.
I know there are RaceKing fans here and they are great for what they are but feel and the clock has proven the big RH as superior for heavy duty on and off road riding. We have a rascal of a 160 spring ride here that's mostly rail trail, 50 miles of rotten ATV trail and maybe 30 miles paved. 3 of us who had that 55 mm RH knobby last year felt it was weapons grade relative to those with a more MTB or spandex crowd setup.
The 48 mm RH knobby tires feel speedier, fit more bikes, but have some single track capability a lot of 40 mm and faster tires don't have.
The Bontrager GR1 were a total pleasant surprise and especially at the old price. New price still makes (to me) Schwalbe G1 some of my pals have a waste of money and their (Schwalbe) edge tread is inferior. I don't know if it was availability or good reviews but Trek raised the price. I wore one out already and will still get one at the new price.
The biggest problem with the Rene Hearse tires is tan walls. I understand the Challenge tires having that color via how they are made but all tan walls do for me is remind me of the craptacular 1970s products and other aspects of the 1970s I didn't think were so great.
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ccand51997
265 posts
#34Mar 24, 2022, 1:07 AM
DarKris wrote:

I'm actually considering that since I now have a second wheelset with more trail oriented tires (oops lol). How do those set up tubeless? I've seen people saying that the sidewalls leak on the non-protection tires so I was a bit hesitant. But knowing that I have a more road oriented wheel I think the Speed King may just be my fastest/most efficient/most comfortable tire option

Since someone else jumped in, I'll give some feedback on the Speedking that I've been using for a long while now. First off, it sealed up tubeless super easy and held air without sealant so well that I rode it for like three weeks with no sealant or tube. I finally ran over a goathead and that was that. I was really high on this tire until I raced it the first time and on the first fast descent with some large gravel I got a cut that eventually sealed but cost me two stops to pump it up.
I patched the cut and ran it tubeless again for a long while and then decided I needed to try another rough, rocky descent to see if the first was a fluke. It was not. The Speedking is a rocket if you are just riding nice groomed dirt, but it can't handle any sort of sharp rock. After that second it had 'shaved' so much of the rubber off the sidewall that it started leaking like crazy and eventually I put a latex tube back in. It is still a great tire to deal with patches of sand around here and the more mild riding I do, but I know its limitations now. It is super fast and probably nearly as fast as road tires. If you extrapolate a bit from the BRR data, I would guess that a Speedking set up tubeless probably rolls at 12-13watts at 25 psi. That is just guessing from the 2015 data where the Speedking was 19 watts. The newer Black chilli improved the Raceking by two-ish watts. When you look at another article he wrote comparing his mtb tube to latex and tubeless he found that a Raceking Racesport was five watts faster tubeless and four watts faster with latex.
I just wish Conti made them in a 45-47 mm width. And that they were easier to find in the US.
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imwjl
304 posts
#35Mar 24, 2022, 8:08 AM
ccand51997 wrote:

Since someone else jumped in, I'll give some feedback on the Speedking that I've been using for a long while now. First off, it sealed up tubeless super easy and held air without sealant so well that I rode it for like three weeks with no sealant or tube. I finally ran over a goathead and that was that. I was really high on this tire until I raced it the first time and on the first fast descent with some large gravel I got a cut that eventually sealed but cost me two stops to pump it up.
I patched the cut and ran it tubeless again for a long while and then decided I needed to try another rough, rocky descent to see if the first was a fluke. It was not. The Speedking is a rocket if you are just riding nice groomed dirt, but it can't handle any sort of sharp rock. After that second it had 'shaved' so much of the rubber off the sidewall that it started leaking like crazy and eventually I put a latex tube back in. It is still a great tire to deal with patches of sand around here and the more mild riding I do, but I know its limitations now. It is super fast and probably nearly as fast as road tires. If you extrapolate a bit from the BRR data, I would guess that a Speedking set up tubeless probably rolls at 12-13watts at 25 psi. That is just guessing from the 2015 data where the Speedking was 19 watts. The newer Black chilli improved the Raceking by two-ish watts. When you look at another article he wrote comparing his mtb tube to latex and tubeless he found that a Raceking Racesport was five watts faster tubeless and four watts faster with latex.
I just wish Conti made them in a 45-47 mm width. And that they were easier to find in the US.
It's probably important to qualify the use. I like Conti tires overall but so far my two sets in 48 and 55 mm Rene Hearse endurance version knobby tires have held up in riding where racy tires have not. The gaps between knobs get straight ahead climbing traction in loose stuff or some mud where a more slick tire fails yet they are speedy on pavement. Price and the stupid looking tan sidewalls would be my gripe.
I wanted to think it was luck that my RH tires have held up but I know other riders who've done the same sharp rock trails and a lot of miles with them.
That RaceSport version looks to do same theme the Bontragers I ended up liking do but in the big 2.2 size.
I know Challenge and Bontrager tire people personally and the testing that goes on at trails I manage has me blow off some of the weight people put on the rolling resistance site. Same for the lab test rig Trek has that replicates real world riding.
I don't believe the BRR tests factor in the bouncing, angles and mixed surfaces I encounter on a ride. I'm not such a great rider and have kept up with better riders on better stuff. Going from less than $1000 - $2000 bikes to my Moots did more for comfort and fit than make some of the same rides noticeably faster.
John Z
174 posts
#36Mar 26, 2022, 3:01 PM
Without sacrificing sidewall protection, Continental Race King Protection are the fastest mountain bike tires. I just put a set on my mountain bike and love the feel.
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Turbogrover
96 posts
#37Mar 29, 2022, 8:35 AM
I have 3 sets of wheels setup for my gravel bike. I'm running the Conti speed kings on one set and yes they are very fast on pavement. Faster than the Race kings on pavement but sketchier on mtb trails. That doesn't bother me since I have an actual mtb if I want to ride those trails.
Setting them up tubeless, I saw the sidewalls did weep when I added sealant, (Stan's) but they eventually sealed up. You may have issues keeping them sealed if you choose to run higher air pressures but mine are good now.
I weigh around 175 lbs and ran the air pressure at 21 psi with 27.5 x 2.2. They felt equally as fast as GK ss 38's on pavement, and have plenty of gravel grip. They're also mounted on my lightest wheelset if that makes any difference.
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Slim
300 posts
#38May 4, 2022, 9:11 AMedited
I just ordered a pair of Speedking Protection tires.
I wanted tanwall, ~2.1”/54mm width and fast rolling with some knobs for a bit of traction, but nothing much needed, gravel roads only with a few paved bits, but no real mtb trail use.
The only other tire I could think of to meet these criteria was one of the Rene Herse knobbies, and I love the look of their tread design. However, Price, dubious bead reliability and unproven rolling resistance of those made the Speedkings and easy choice.
They were hard to find, so still waiting for them to arrive. Fingers crossed it’s in time for the first gravel ‘race’.
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DarKris
83 posts
#39May 19, 2022, 8:38 PM
Slim wrote:
I just ordered a pair of Speedking Protection tires.
I wanted tanwall, ~2.1”/54mm width and fast rolling with some knobs for a bit of traction, but nothing much needed, gravel roads only with a few paved bits, but no real mtb trail use.
The only other tire I could think of to meet these criteria was one of the Rene Herse knobbies, and I love the look of their tread design. However, Price, dubious bead reliability and unproven rolling resistance of those made the Speedkings and easy choice.
They were hard to find, so still waiting for them to arrive. Fingers crossed it’s in time for the first gravel ‘race’.

I have not seen the Speedkings in a tanwall or Protection casing, only racesport. Mind showing pics if you have some?
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Slim
300 posts
#40May 19, 2022, 10:08 PMedited
DarKris wrote:

they got here 4 days after the race.

I have not seen the Speedkings in a tanwall or Protection casing, only racesport. Mind showing pics if you have some?

I’ll try and remember tomorrow.

it is a strange look. Almost a red, copper kind of look. Nothing like any of the other brown or tan walls I have seen.
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